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inventor notes
Posted by Anonymous . updated on 2/26/2009
Hi,
Are there resource that show samples of how inventor notes should be maintained?
I am aware of some of the dos and donts (like using a pen, page numbering, taking signature etc.)
But what I am really interested in is to see what level of details are put. I have read somewhere that
abstracting out ideas as figures is better and easier way.
Regards,
Answers (8)
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JimIvey
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I think the traditional approach is to use bound lab-books, each page signed and dated at the end of the day by a witness knowledgeable in the relevant technology -- typically the engineer in the next cubicle. I believe ink (non-erasable) is typically used. I would suggest one pen and only one pen be used for each page (to avoid the appearance of revision after-the-fact). Being bound, insertion of pages is impractical in the lab-books. There have been threads in these forums about keeping track of electronic notes. In response to those discussions, I played around with the idea of trusted 3rd-party timestamp authentication. Here's my last version of that. Regards.
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MYK
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Quote from: JimIvey on 11-19-08 at 02:34 pm In response to those discussions, I played around with the idea of trusted 3rd-party timestamp authentication. Here's my last version of that.
Assuming it does keep some sort of copy, I'd be curious about security of the data, although I can understand if you wouldn't want to discuss that. ("Security through obscurity" is not necessarily useful, but it can be one layer.)
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sharanbr
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Quote from: JimIvey on 11-19-08 at 02:34 pm I think the traditional approach is to use bound lab-books, each page signed and dated at the end of the day by a witness knowledgeable in the relevant technology -- typically the engineer in the next cubicle. I believe ink (non-erasable) is typically used. I would suggest one pen and only one pen be used for each page (to avoid the appearance of revision after-the-fact). Being bound, insertion of pages is impractical in the lab-books. There have been threads in these forums about keeping track of electronic notes. In response to those discussions, I played around with the idea of trusted 3rd-party timestamp authentication. Here's my last version of that. Regards.
Just couple of points ..
1) it is generally impractical to get book signed on a regular basis. What if I complete the whole stuff in one go and
then get them signed all at a time. The stage I am in, I can actually put the whole idea in a week, since I have kind
of worked out the SW prototype
2) In my original mail, I was also wondering if I can see sample inventor notes
Regards
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MYK
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Regarding (1), the idea behind the notebook is to protect you from the time you come up with the idea until the time you file your patent application. Having the books signed on an ongoing basis is more for when you have an idea that you develop over a long time. If you've already worked out the details, you can just get the whole thing signed off at once and give the "engineer in the next cubicle" writer's cramp.
If money is no object, you could also write out the details and file them as a provisional patent application. The datestamp on the PPA would serve the same function as the witnessed and dated notebook.
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JimIvey
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Quote from: MYK on 11-19-08 at 04:42 pm Does this utility store a copy of the document, or an MD5SUM, or a digitally signed copy, or ... ?
It's extremely simple -- no database even....
It stores text-file timestamps where the filename is the md5sum of an uploaded file.
The logic is very simple.
- Get current time (to avoid delay).
- Get md5sum for the received file.
- If a timestamp named with the md5sum is found, report the timestamp.
- Otherwise, record the receipt time (from above) in a file named with the md5sum.
There is no persistent copy of the uploaded file.
Of course, there's a chance (albeit a very small one) that two different files will generate the same md5sum. Oh well..... That's why it's version 0.3.
If I were to commercialize that in any way, I'd use a database and store other information -- sender IP address, original filename (path?), etc. -- to offer some additional confidence that the timestamp doesn't refer to some other file. I'd also take care to securely delete all temporary copies of the uploaded file as soon as practicable and verify clock accuracy more frequently and with better documentation.
Regards.
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Wiscagent
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"what I am really interested in is to see what level of details are put."
If your notebook were used as evidence in a hearing or trial, could a person having ordinary skill in the art understand what you did, and the significance of your work? Put a different way, could the relevant pages of your notebood document that your claimed invention was developed by a certain date?
So the notebook typically needs more than just a log of your work, it should also include some of the reasoning explaining why things were done in a particular manner, what was the objective of the work, and what conclusions did you draw from the work.
As for "abstracting out ideas a figures", if a person of ordinary skill in the art would best understand your work that way, then that's the way to go. But I'd suggest expressing your efforts in several different ways ... tables, figures, using different words, photographs, samples ... whatever is most appropriate in your field of art.
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MYK
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Quote from: JimIvey on 11-20-08 at 04:05 pm Does this utility store a copy of the document, or an MD5SUM, or a digitally signed copy, or ... ?
It's extremely simple -- no database even.... It stores text-file timestamps where the filename is the md5sum of an uploaded file. The logic is very simple. - Get current time (to avoid delay).
- Get md5sum for the received file.
- If a timestamp named with the md5sum is found, report the timestamp.
- Otherwise, record the receipt time (from above) in a file named with the md5sum.
There is no persistent copy of the uploaded file. Of course, there's a chance (albeit a very small one) that two different files will generate the same md5sum. Oh well..... That's why it's version 0.3. If I were to commercialize that in any way, I'd use a database and store other information -- sender IP address, original filename (path?), etc. -- to offer some additional confidence that the timestamp doesn't refer to some other file. I'd also take care to securely delete all temporary copies of the uploaded file as soon as practicable and verify clock accuracy more frequently and with better documentation. Regards.
http://www.win.tue.nl/hashclash/SoftIntCodeSign/
We announce two different Win32 executable files with different functionality but identical MD5 hash values. This shows that trust in MD5 as a tool for verifying software integrity, and as a hash function used in code signing, has become questionable. Basically, they've found a way to modify a file and still generate the same MD5sum. From what I recall of the news when they announced it last year, they can make the file modifications and deliberately target the same sum; it's not a matter of luck. There are obvious issues in that an electronic document with random characters (maybe even non-ASCII) thrown in would be suspect, but for a version that could be relied upon as an admissible authentication, I think the document would have to be stored somewhere, which leads to both storage space and storage security issues.
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JimIvey
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Thanks. I was never "married" to MD5. Just wanted to prove the concept, see how it might be done.
Regards.
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